Paweł Kadysz Yes, perfect. This could encourage people to give constructive criticism. As we know, a lot of people here are feeling uncomfortable doing that. They should not.

Aga Ka I would not worry about word ''criticism'' and that it might sound negative to some people. People who cannot deal with word criticism cause it sounds ''to negative'' will most likely not be able to handle receiving feedback/advise anyway.... ;-)

Tomek Zimnocho Words you are using can change reception of and reaction for your message without changing message itself.

Aga Ka ''Words you are using can change reception of and reaction for your message without changing message itself.'' Indeed, it does not really matter if I use word ''criticism'' or ''feedback'' :) (I am talking about that specific case)

agnieszka bladzik you would be suprised, also in different cultres the percpetion of worlds itself is far more important then the in Poland. At work I have some stakeholders in US and in Asia and they really can point out one word in sentance and said your whole message in negative although that was not the intention. to sum up feedback is good word

Aga Ka Yes, where I live people are being really sensitive sometimes too. The thing is though that I can be sensitive (lets call it that for the lack of better word at the moment) all I want but you don't know me and you don't know which things/words I am sensitive about. You don't know what I see as negative. How will you decide what and how to say to me? I think the key is to be polite and respectful. It should not be our goal to be negative. At the same time we cannot please all people simply because what one person will see as negative the other will not but that other person will perceive other things/words as negative. And once we will try to cater to all the people there is no end of that game and things are not getting better and nicer... I see it around me really often. And this is one of the things I love about my country and polish people: we (in general) seem to take words for what they mean. :) Also I agree that ''feedback'' is a good word, my point was that both words are just as good to use.

Piotr Daniel Yeah, Asian people are crazy sensitive... Sometimes a simple statement of facts is considered offensive / negative / threatening to them... Makes them really hard to work with sometimes.

FlyteWizard Yeah, smartphones have really good cameras now. Don't feel like you can't take on this challenge if you don't have the newest camera model on the market.

Kazzi The most important gear is that between the viewfinder and the back of Your head.

Look at tookapic.com/cameras. Two most popular ones - iPhones. Photos-awesome. Really, it's the photographer, not the gear.

Rafał Bolko Something like: "Gun's don't kill people ..." :) = Cameras don't shoot photos, people shoot photos!

ponzu @Paweł doesn't have to put this in the manifesto, but here is what I learned a few years back. People who know say: "Camera's don't take photos, people take photos." People who really know say: "Camera's don't take photos, people don't take photos, lenses take photos." It's something that you tell yourself if you don't know whether $1000 is a good price for a lens. It's not something we need to tell the new and prospective Tookapickers. I would go with the "your vision and persistence are more important than you gear" theme.

Tomek Zimnocho I can’t agree. Even best lens in hands of someone who doesn’t feel it can produce sharp, colourful and boring picture. On the other hand recently I was watching photos taken by some students of local college. Old analog camera with cheap, old lenses and I couldn’t stop looking at them. People take photos. Not gear.

Marta Tomaszewska Ha! that's funny, because I've started 365 excatly on the day when I bought "worse" camera :D I've put aside canon full-frame with L lenses to make use of sony compact camera and it started to work! ;-)

ponzu This will be a great conversation to have outside of this thread. I only brought it up because it is such a memorable line. No one is saying that a good lens will automatically produce great photos in the hands of a skillless photographer. What it says is that a good photographer with a good camera will reach his or her limit without investing in high end lenses. Look at the tennis, football or wildlife photos that get printed in magazines. No amount of skill or vision will allow you to take them without a $1000+ lens, most likely a $1500+ lens. The saying "Cameras don't take photos, people don't take photos, lenses take photos" is not about a good lens in the hands of a beginner, it's about a mediocre lens in the hands of a skillful photographer. It all has to come together and, outside of skill, experience, vision and inspiration, which are all necessary, upgrading the lens has more impact than upgrading the camera.

Ian Prince Be kind to others but also remember to be kind to yourself.

Krzysztof Maciejewski You will start to perceive the world differently - see it with photographic frames, light, composition. This is the result of everyday photo shooting.

littlehuman But maybe "coercion" will be a better word than "duty".

ponzu I believe the word you are looking for is "chore".

Kazzi The best photography course, on that for sure we can all agree.

Paweł Kadysz Dos and dont’s are also good. More dos though - we want to encourage people to do stuff and not to forbid them doing other stuff.

Gosia Is tookapic for "pure" photos only, really? I don't agree, especially that we have some amazing, creative people here that don't follow this "rule".

ponzu Again, I am probably posting pitches as to why it's a great idea to join Tookapic rather that guidelines what to do once someone joins. @Paweł give us more guidance as to what works and does not work for you in our suggestions. Maybe copy and paste the most usable paragraphs into the original post, so we know not to duplicate them, but to build upon them.

agnieszka bladzik i don't agree with this 3 types of days. there are days where i know what i'm doing i will take prepared photos, few of them, will edit, it will not take much time etc. everybody here have different working/photographing style and that's fine

ponzu You are lucky.

jokele With this description I probably would not have signed up. It's not my goal to share live online. Okay, there are images about live and became like a diary. But my goal was to get used to my camera and lenses. Better knowing which parameters to use to get the image I want to have. Improving my post processing skills - but never sharing live online.

The last image of my dog has nothing to do with live. My goal was to take this shot with a flash and to try some post processing techniques. Of course this images tells about live to me as well. How I did the shot with my dog and what I tried to get the image.

Maybe we have complete different understanding about our project goals and I now may understand why you call some of your images streak ones but which are in my point of view great images.

Do you count images, which don't tell anything about live and are just done for learning purposes as streak ones?

I mean, the description is too one-sided. There are different goals to start this project. We had this thread a while ago tookapic.com/talks/216-what-to... Maybe there are additional goals to find.

Aga Ka I understand what you mean @jokele , I also understand @Paweł. Noone has to share their lives of course, but I understand what Pawel means when he says he wants to distinguish Tookapic from platforms like instagram or FB. Maybe now that tookapic is not free anymore the risk of getting FB-like dinner pics (you all know what I mean ;-) ) is smaller? I think I would stay with the goal of getting bettter at taking pictures. and why not to add that some of us are documenting our lives (like Pawel wrote it already) and some of us choose diffrent way to complete this project? It is up to you what way you choose to complete yours? Not sure if I made myselff clear, my 2 year old running like hell :P

Paweł Kadysz Obviously one of the biggest gain from using Tookapic is improving your photography. However, advertising Tookapic as just that - a way to improve photography - failed miserably. The number of people starting 365 to improve photography is very, very low.

You're absolutely right - there are probably thousands of reasons to start the project. That's why the main copy on the homepage should be strong, but applicable to many.

By the way, I think that the fact we take and publish daily on Tookapic says a lot about our lives, no matter if we shoot to improve or to document. There is a reason you took a photo of your dog couple of days ago (whis by the way is an awesome photo).

I think your project in particular has a very documentary feel.

Aga Ka I get your point. I am not sure if I would sign up to tookapic with that description (about documenting life) either, but then again I am bit different then most people so maybe that is an indication of coming succes :P

jokele > The number of people starting 365 to improve photography is very, very low.

Oh, that's really surprising!

> I think your project in particular has a very documentary feel.

Yes, that happened with the time. But my point is, that this is something that wasn't my plan. As @Aga pointed out, It's up to you (you, me, ...) how you make your project. There are different goals and I find your suggestion too one-sided. Maybe you should add a few more goals to your text, so people like me are not "scared" ;-)

And thank you, for the awesome photo :-D

Paweł Kadysz Thank you. I will work on that more and try to make it more generic.

ponzu I see both your and @Aga's points. The great thing about Tokapic is that can be either: a place to document and share one's life (my reason for joining) and to improve one's photography (perhaps Aga's reason). Not to mention that to someone it's a way to connect with people over photography. The challenge is: how do you get newcomers interested and hooked? What made me seek out a 365 platform was the story about a guy who took a photo a day until he died, and now his photos are celebrated by friend, family and strangers as something worthy and meaningful. But how do you put that in a pitch? I thinking about one's mortality the best motivator?

Jennifer Always happy to help! :)

In terms of grammar, the "pitch" section you wrote is spot on. However, as has come up on the "feedback v criticism" talk, word choice can matter a lot. To a native English speaker, saying "We document" has a very clinical feel that doesn't accurately represent the joy of tookapic, whether it is for people sharing their lives or people getting better at photography (even though ultimately it becomes both.)

On that point, I would argue that if those are the 2 main reasons people come, they end up doing the one they hadn't. Example: I started my project as a personal way to remember my life, as well as to prove I could do something consistently for a long time. BUT, after 4 years, I have fallen in love with photography, shot a few weddings, paid for some hostel stays with photos, and traveled around the world to meet new people. I went for the social, but also got the photography.

On the other hand, the community here is so strong that those who come just to improve their photography can also make friends and find mentors and inspiration and get support when they're sick and post a quick snapshot that they didn't have time to create, just take.

Looping it back around, I think we need some way to blend these two together. Photography as well as social. Social as well as photography. You get out what you put in. Just want to post your pics - that's fine. Want to make friends too? Comment, hit up talks, etc. But it's your call.

I imagine some kind of venn diagram-ish thing (but nicer) with blending edges that combine the two aspects. For the visual element, anyway. Maybe two vertical columns:

I'm here for the photography.......................I'm here for the community
......................................... But we can give you both.

(dots for spacing to show visual)
Or "On tookapic, we share both" etc